It had to happen

Discussion in 'Hockey Talk' started by m_peroni, Mar 2, 2012.

  1. m_peroni

    m_peroni
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    At some point, Ron WIlson had to be fired. I can't blame him entirely since the goaltending was inconsistent all season long and the whole team does not have that much quality depth. Nonetheless, he could not get the effort from these guys. It should be a grinding, hard working team and it looked so lethargic and phlegmatic to the point where if the players were not traded, the change had to happen behind the bench.

    I was not sure about the timing of this firing, though, because i could not think of a good coaching candidate to take over. I completely forgot about the man who won the Cup, Carlyle. The guy is tough, but slick hockey sense and knowledge. I don't think he will make a big difference down the final stretch, but he is put in place to get to know the team better and to participate in the evaluation of this team in the off-season by addressing what he needs to Burke.

    Good hiring, but changes must be made this off-season...........of course if the CBA is done.
     
  2. Sir Rodney

    Sir Rodney
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    A Grand Guesture

    I have to admit that I don't watch the Leafs much but when I have, I keep wondering why Leaf fans were so optimistic about this team being Playoff bound. You know what I feel about his trading the first round picks in order to get Kessel. I realize Kessel has become the best forward on the Leafs but that presupposes that the trade he made was the only way Burke could have obtained a player or combination of players who would have provided as much offense for the Leafs, particularly after four years of development.

    To my way of thinking, a team has to have good goal tending, quality defensemen in the top four and at least two top centres to four a nucleus to build on. The wingers and depth players come later in the process. Sure it can be argued that there has to be far more than the core I've outlined but if you don't have those components, you aren't going anywhere.

    The next problem is that other teams aren't necessarily going to provide those so you have to draft and develop them. That takes time and can only happen if there's a consensus towards that goal within the organization.

    Have the Leafs drafted as well as they could under Burke's watch? Were they so hard pressed in terms of free agents that they settled for less than they needed just to fill a roster? Contract extensions apparently were not Burke's forte either. Are all of Michael Grange's points nothing more than his own personal rant or is there a valid reason to be looking beyond Wilson as to why the Leafs aren't better than hoped for in Leaf's Nation?

    Burke started off with a six year mandate to produce a top team in Toronto. Now that is down to two years. If he can pull it off, he will deserve all the accolades he will get. Right now he seems to be perpetuating a myth and if I was a Leafs fan, I would be pissed. Firing Wilson was easy. Fixing the problem with the pieces in place will be a heck of a lot harder.

    http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/03/02/grange_burke_firing_wilson/
     
  3. Sir Rodney

    Sir Rodney
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    Gesture

    Forgive me. I was sleepy.
     
  4. rikster

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    Re: A Grand Guesture

    I don't think the Leafs had a hope in heck of being a Cup contender in 5 years, I don't think any team can do it starting from where the Leafs did playing in a market like Toronto's ...

    I do think Burkey has done a lousy job of player contracts and I wonder how much of that was Nonis?...

    He was always on the generous side and as much as many in Vancouver want to credit Nonis for many of the current Canucks, I don't think they are competitive if Nonis is still here because I don't think he gets players signed at under contract value the way Gillis has....

    Take care...
     
  5. m_peroni

    m_peroni
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    Re: A Grand Guesture

    Gillis has gotten some chunky contracts as well.

    The guy did not sign, but acquired Booth and Ballard with fat contracts for their worth. Bieksa got a pricey contract as well. Hamhuis's is not cheap either. So...i don't think the contracts are an issue here.

    In Toronto, i think the UFAs are overpaid like most UFAs around the league are anyway. Connolly and Armstrong. Komisarek as well, and i think Schenn's contract was potential based, which is risky.

    Otherwise, Kessel has a very good contract and the others as well.

    I do think that Burke tried way too much to get that sleeper goaltender with Gustavsson and Reimer. I mean, Reimer is talented, but he has not been the same since the injury and you can't know if he will rebound next season.

    It seems as if it is getting harder to sign UFAs for the Maple Leafs unless the paycheck makes it worth it for them. So at this point, the best way to build is through trades and draft. Drafting has been mediocre, so the trades need to get better.

    Burke will have a lot of work to do this off-season, but the CBA may be a complicated issue that affects his planning.
     
  6. rikster

    rikster
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    Re: A Grand Guesture

    Many in Vancouver felt that the Canucks were close to being a Cup contender when the axe fell on Nonis...

    Gillis said in his first press conference that the team was not close and that upset a lot of fans and media members....

    In hindsight, Gillis was right and Nonis was wrong...

    Who do you credit? In my opinion its ownership for accepting the critique and agreeing to go along with the many changes and improvements which all came with a price tag...

    When Burke was hired in Toronto, I thought he was the person who would have the ability to control ownership and build the team the right way...

    Wasn't that the reason he was given a 6 year contract?

    In hindsight he has been a disaster and has tried to cut corners in the same way those before him did...

    For me this is no different than the disaster happening in Calgary, a GM who doesn't have the b*lls to tell ownership that the team sucks and needs a complete overhaul that will take time and patience with some luck thrown in....

    Building on the fly?, how do you do that given the core Burkey inherited?

    Take care...
     
  7. Sir Rodney

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    Bruins - Rangers Game

    Hi Mick,

    I realize this has nothing to do with this Leafs thread but I was wondering about your reaction to the finish of the Rangers/Bruins game yesterday. I didn't see the entire game but I did catch the bit at the end when the Rangers were hanging on to close out the game by freezing the puck along the end boards. Lucic nailed the Ranger player into the glass which could easily have been either a boarding or head shot. The Ranger player responded within the parameters of what would normally be allowed. Lucic then hit the Ranger with three lefts to the face cutting him on his right cheek. Lucic had already been in a fight with Brandon Prust earlier in the game so this was his second fight.

    I've been looking to see if there was any follow up to this in terms of a fine or suspension but I haven't seen anything.

    Did I miss something or is this another example of the Bruins being immune from consequence for their actions?
     
  8. Clint27

    Clint27
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    Re: Bruins - Rangers Game

    I used to be a Lucic fan, but that was bush league. How can the league even THINK about removing fighting from the game when that sort of thing is allowed to happen?? It'll be like bullying in the school yard!
     
  9. Clint27

    Clint27
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    As I've said before, I don't think Wilson was the right coach for this group anymore.
    In comparing the Leafs from the first of the year to now, they've done a 180 degree turn.
    Kessel was backchecking and forechecking, playing a very complete game. The defence was playing well too! Phaneuf was banging, not making mistake or getting beat, same with Schenn...now? They all seem to be playing with little or no emotion. They don't really have any energy to their game.
    It'll be interesting to see how Carlyle fares.
    I don't think Toronto is a market that will allow the team to build through the draft. Guys don't get the long leash to develop like they do in other centres. In the summer there was a lot of angst because Schenn wasn't re-signed, getting rid of him was thought of as the worst thing to do, now the fans want rid of him. Last year, Reimer was going to be given the key to the city! He did play well, but this year he has the sophmore jinx!! Should he make more saves? Yes. But now the kid gets the bronx cheer when he makes a routine save. Gustavsson saved the Leafs when Reimer got hurt, but has be been given the ball to run with now that Reimer is struggling? No.
    Toronto won't wait for a winner, even though with that mentality, we are!
     
  10. Clint27

    Clint27
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    In watching the Leaf/Flyers game last night...

    ...the result was the same, but watching the game was like watching paint dry!! BORING!!! The only thing was Bob Cole did the play by play, and I didn't have to listen to Craig Simpson drone on!!
    I'd prefer to watch an exciting game to what the Leafs play now.
     
  11. m_peroni

    m_peroni
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    Re: Bruins - Rangers Game

    I don't recall that it was worthy of suspension, otherwise i would have posted it on here with a very angry tone towards the league and Lucic :)
     
  12. m_peroni

    m_peroni
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    Re: In watching the Leaf/Flyers game last night...

    Well, it's late in the season, a handful of games left and a new coach coming in has no time to introduce his philosophy and his strategies. So, best thing to do is to stick to the basics and coach a defensive style of game that demands player's responsibility, focus, and you pretty much roll the dice with it.
     
  13. m_peroni

    m_peroni
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    Re:Carter Ashton

    I like this player. He played some good hockey with a rough edge. I did not see much offensive abilities in him in this game, but that can take time.

    Leafs should keep Reimer, but definitely let go of Gustavsson and get a real starting goaltender.
     

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